[NewCandle] Constrained hydrolysis

[Keith Nagel]

Hey Gents,

You know, I always wondered about hydrogen torches and magnets
since I ran across such a device described in CL Strongs
"Amateur Scientist" column in the old SA ( yep, that
was an amateur project in 1968, unlike today's column
which features such inspiring experiments as measuring
the pH of your pool ). Ahem.

Anyway, I can't find the photocopy in my files (damn dead trees)
but basically a highschool kid did the grunt work
helped along by his dad who was some kind of aeronautical
engineer. The intent was to measure thrust from the
torch, and the basic design was an H2 torch with a large
electromagnet. The flame bent when it passed thru the
field, and this resulted in more thrust. I still don't
really understand it, but if you have the CL Strong column
CD you can find the article for some "basement lab" advice. 

Now I understand why the flame gets bent, but why does
this increase thrust? Isn't this system conservative? Unlike
Jones example the torch was in open air and the field
caused the flame to bend. So I'm not sure about the
'constraint' argument applying there. 

K.

BTW, cool experiment with Browns gas! Did you write any
of that work up, or was it just for the company? 

-----Original Message-----
From: newcandle-bounces at ipdiscover.com
[mailto:newcandle-bounces at ipdiscover.com]On Behalf Of Nick Reiter
Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2007 9:03 AM
To: New energy for the new world.
Subject: Re: [NewCandle] Constrained hydrolysis


A few years ago, when I was actually trying to
characterize what was coming out of a Brown's Gas
electrolyzer (On company time and payroll even! Yow!)
one of the techniques we used was a spectrometer
borrowed from the University of Toledo.  We set up in
a dark room, lit a small steady flame, got spectral
data for it, then ran a control flame of hydrogen and
oxygen blended from bottles for comparison.  Per
expectation, the spectra were identical.  Of course
this doesn't address energy content, just composition.

Jones' idea of accelerating the H2 through an oriface
using magnetics and molecular filtering sounds pretty
cool.  Could you try the concept out, though, for
starters just by comparing energy balance for flames
of gas squirted through teensy nozzles for high
velocity, versus a fat slow flow flame?

I've kept a similar notion alive for a couple of
years, back from 2005 when I was playing with the
cathode plasma electrolysis.  As you might recall, I
had put my beaker on a big ferrite magnet, and found
that the electrolyte began whirling as a tidy little
MHD motor effect.  I spent some time looking for
whether the acceleration of the electrolyte was adding
anything to the heat or light of the cathode plasma,
and never came to a conclusion.  If it did, it was not
within my crude regimes of measuring.

Gases could be far ginchier, tho!

N

--- Keith Nagel <NewCandleAdmin at ipdiscover.com> wrote:

> Likely I would try putting a pair of electrodes
> into the sealed cell and spark them periodically.
> But most chemists would recommend a recombiner with
> catalyst. A flame would only work where there is
> substantial gas flow. That said, the flame arrestors
> I've seen used by Brown and others were porous
> ceramic.
> This is a commercial product that's easy to get.
> 
> K.
> 



 
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